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	<title>Comments on: The truth about JW &#8220;Bible Studies&#8221;</title>
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		<title>By: Inside Us</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-2#comment-846</link>
		<dc:creator>Inside Us</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Dec 2011 17:36:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;a href=&#039;#comment-807&#039; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@JEHOVAH&#039;S SERVANT&lt;/a&gt; - 
I became a JW and after baptism I learned about the JW&#039;s from a different perspective and regret the baptism, I love Jehovah, always have and always will. But I no longer want to be a &quot;JW&quot; all I wanted to do was love Jehovah and Jesus and learn more about them. I feel like I&#039;ve been dragged into something I didn&#039;t bargain for..I loved the  people  and wish things didn&#039;t get so ugly when you realize you made a decision and now you&#039;re having second thoughts.When you try to make your own decisions the beauty offered turns to ashes. That&#039;s how I feel currently. I feel there is no gray areas as a JW things are black or white. It hurts my heart. Your life is no longer your own and I just can&#039;t live this way, it doesn&#039;t feel right to me? Shaky Now.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;846&#039;,&#039;Inside Us&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href='#comment-807' rel="nofollow">@JEHOVAH&#8217;S SERVANT</a> &#8211;<br />
I became a JW and after baptism I learned about the JW&#8217;s from a different perspective and regret the baptism, I love Jehovah, always have and always will. But I no longer want to be a &#8220;JW&#8221; all I wanted to do was love Jehovah and Jesus and learn more about them. I feel like I&#8217;ve been dragged into something I didn&#8217;t bargain for..I loved the  people  and wish things didn&#8217;t get so ugly when you realize you made a decision and now you&#8217;re having second thoughts.When you try to make your own decisions the beauty offered turns to ashes. That&#8217;s how I feel currently. I feel there is no gray areas as a JW things are black or white. It hurts my heart. Your life is no longer your own and I just can&#8217;t live this way, it doesn&#8217;t feel right to me? Shaky Now.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('846','Inside Us'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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		<title>By: Editor</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-2#comment-810</link>
		<dc:creator>Editor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jul 2011 08:22:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-810</guid>
		<description>Current and former Jehovah&#039;s Witnesses who read this article will instantly know which one of us is presenting &quot;a pile of crock.&quot; Many years ago the Watchtower was open for more comprehensive and expanded commentary from the audience. But that was a while back. The whole point of the Watchtower study, and for that matter the book studies as well, is to simply pull answers directly from each paragraph and then move on to the next one. They just want to get the material covered within the limited time allotted.

You may be fortunate to belong to a Kingdom Hall that has a more liberal body of elders. There are many congregations out there with excellent leaders who are more flexible in their use of Watchtower Society guidelines. By far the majority, I am sad to say, tend to take a more conservative approach to study meetings and do not want a lot of embellishment by either the Watchtower study conductor or those in the audience who answer the questions. The study meetings have become a joke in most congregations. 

The public talks have become so strictly outlined by the Watchtower that most brothers do little more than  read the outline itself and only those Bible scriptures that the outline insists on being read. 

JWs who insist on expanding their responses or modify any of the talk outlines will soon find themselves in a meeting with a local committee. This is not to say they will actually be punished for sharing their own thoughts, but they will find their participation restricted. Elders who expand or modify public talk outlines will quickly lose that privilege.
 
The result is that most study meetings, even at 45 minutes, will seem to go on forever and be dull as stale toast. 

I invite anyone reading this article to actually go to a local Kingdom Hall and sit through a Sunday meeting set of public talk and Watchtower study. See for yourself who is telling the truth. In fact, go to two or three Kingdom Halls in your area and see how the meetings are conducted. After that, feel free to submit your comments to this article page and let us know the results. Who really tells the truth about this matter? The editor of this website? Or the writer identified as &quot;Jehovah&#039;s Servant&quot;?

Maybe things are different in the UK where &quot;Jehovah&#039;s Servant&quot; resides, but I doubt it. The editor can only describe the current situation in USA Kingdom Halls. Maybe the UK and Europe are far more liberal. If so, please share that information with us. If anyone wants to share an address of a Kingdom Hall where answering at the Watchtower study is wide open to additional commentary or questions, please do so. We&#039;d love to know where those liberal Kingdom Halls are. 

Unfortunately, so would the Watchtower Society...&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;810&#039;,&#039;Editor&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Current and former Jehovah&#8217;s Witnesses who read this article will instantly know which one of us is presenting &#8220;a pile of crock.&#8221; Many years ago the Watchtower was open for more comprehensive and expanded commentary from the audience. But that was a while back. The whole point of the Watchtower study, and for that matter the book studies as well, is to simply pull answers directly from each paragraph and then move on to the next one. They just want to get the material covered within the limited time allotted.</p>
<p>You may be fortunate to belong to a Kingdom Hall that has a more liberal body of elders. There are many congregations out there with excellent leaders who are more flexible in their use of Watchtower Society guidelines. By far the majority, I am sad to say, tend to take a more conservative approach to study meetings and do not want a lot of embellishment by either the Watchtower study conductor or those in the audience who answer the questions. The study meetings have become a joke in most congregations. </p>
<p>The public talks have become so strictly outlined by the Watchtower that most brothers do little more than  read the outline itself and only those Bible scriptures that the outline insists on being read. </p>
<p>JWs who insist on expanding their responses or modify any of the talk outlines will soon find themselves in a meeting with a local committee. This is not to say they will actually be punished for sharing their own thoughts, but they will find their participation restricted. Elders who expand or modify public talk outlines will quickly lose that privilege.</p>
<p>The result is that most study meetings, even at 45 minutes, will seem to go on forever and be dull as stale toast. </p>
<p>I invite anyone reading this article to actually go to a local Kingdom Hall and sit through a Sunday meeting set of public talk and Watchtower study. See for yourself who is telling the truth. In fact, go to two or three Kingdom Halls in your area and see how the meetings are conducted. After that, feel free to submit your comments to this article page and let us know the results. Who really tells the truth about this matter? The editor of this website? Or the writer identified as &#8220;Jehovah&#8217;s Servant&#8221;?</p>
<p>Maybe things are different in the UK where &#8220;Jehovah&#8217;s Servant&#8221; resides, but I doubt it. The editor can only describe the current situation in USA Kingdom Halls. Maybe the UK and Europe are far more liberal. If so, please share that information with us. If anyone wants to share an address of a Kingdom Hall where answering at the Watchtower study is wide open to additional commentary or questions, please do so. We&#8217;d love to know where those liberal Kingdom Halls are. </p>
<p>Unfortunately, so would the Watchtower Society&#8230;
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('810','Editor'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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		<title>By: JEHOVAH'S SERVANT</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-1#comment-807</link>
		<dc:creator>JEHOVAH'S SERVANT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jul 2011 15:47:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-807</guid>
		<description>Well to be honest I have never read such a pile of crock. Any one who answers in the Watch tower study is free to say what they want as long as it is in line with the matter of the topic. No one is talked to by the Elders for doing so, that would defeat the purpose of the whole thing, to learn and take in knowledge and to hear the points of view of the other Brothers and Sisters.
Many people benefit from the Bible study program, we have many here in my City who just wish to have a study to find out what the Bible is really teaching us and many of them have no intention what so ever of converting or even getting baptised.
For Apostate ramblings and misinformation i must say that you get the GOLD award....&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;807&#039;,&#039;JEHOVAH\&#039;S SERVANT&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well to be honest I have never read such a pile of crock. Any one who answers in the Watch tower study is free to say what they want as long as it is in line with the matter of the topic. No one is talked to by the Elders for doing so, that would defeat the purpose of the whole thing, to learn and take in knowledge and to hear the points of view of the other Brothers and Sisters.<br />
Many people benefit from the Bible study program, we have many here in my City who just wish to have a study to find out what the Bible is really teaching us and many of them have no intention what so ever of converting or even getting baptised.<br />
For Apostate ramblings and misinformation i must say that you get the GOLD award&#8230;.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('807','JEHOVAH\'S SERVANT'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Editor</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-1#comment-729</link>
		<dc:creator>Editor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 May 2011 22:12:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-729</guid>
		<description>@Kurt,

Thank you for your comments. All this website is trying to do is to explain to someone who is unfamiliar with how the Watchtower Society works or what Jehovah&#039;s Witnesses really believe, that what they are told about having a Bible study with JWs, may not really match reality.

JWs get so excited whenever they start a new Bible study with a potential convert. As long as the study moves along at the pace they determine and the &quot;study&quot; doesn&#039;t ask too many pointed or embarrassing questions, then everything is just &quot;rosey.&quot;  The minute they are faced with some resistance or unpleasant facts from the Watchtower&#039;s past they get all flustered and look for ways to give up quickly.  JWs do not really enjoy confrontation.

I remember, before I became a JW, that as a child I would go to Sunday School at local Protestant churches. All of us kids would get a little book to read, and we would hear the teacher tell us Bible stories. We just assumed that the teacher was telling us the truth. We&#039;d go to Sunday School while we were kids and at some point in the future we&#039;d be baptized and become  Baptists or Methodists, or something. We never asked questions - never argued with the teacher. Never looked things up to see if we were being told the truth. We just accepted what we were told at face value.

That&#039;s the way that Jehovah&#039;s Witnesses want to conduct &quot;Bible&quot; book studies with adults.  Don&#039;t ask questions. Don&#039;t do research. Just look at the pretty pictures and accept what they say at face value.

Adults don&#039;t like to be treated that way, not if they have adult level intelligence. We like to ask questions. We want to dig deeper. We want to explore contradictions or gaps in logic.

Jehovah&#039;s Witnesses will bail out on anyone who really makes them work at  conducting a real intense Bible study. You found that out and so have a couple of others who have commented on the above article.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;729&#039;,&#039;Editor&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Kurt,</p>
<p>Thank you for your comments. All this website is trying to do is to explain to someone who is unfamiliar with how the Watchtower Society works or what Jehovah&#8217;s Witnesses really believe, that what they are told about having a Bible study with JWs, may not really match reality.</p>
<p>JWs get so excited whenever they start a new Bible study with a potential convert. As long as the study moves along at the pace they determine and the &#8220;study&#8221; doesn&#8217;t ask too many pointed or embarrassing questions, then everything is just &#8220;rosey.&#8221;  The minute they are faced with some resistance or unpleasant facts from the Watchtower&#8217;s past they get all flustered and look for ways to give up quickly.  JWs do not really enjoy confrontation.</p>
<p>I remember, before I became a JW, that as a child I would go to Sunday School at local Protestant churches. All of us kids would get a little book to read, and we would hear the teacher tell us Bible stories. We just assumed that the teacher was telling us the truth. We&#8217;d go to Sunday School while we were kids and at some point in the future we&#8217;d be baptized and become  Baptists or Methodists, or something. We never asked questions &#8211; never argued with the teacher. Never looked things up to see if we were being told the truth. We just accepted what we were told at face value.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s the way that Jehovah&#8217;s Witnesses want to conduct &#8220;Bible&#8221; book studies with adults.  Don&#8217;t ask questions. Don&#8217;t do research. Just look at the pretty pictures and accept what they say at face value.</p>
<p>Adults don&#8217;t like to be treated that way, not if they have adult level intelligence. We like to ask questions. We want to dig deeper. We want to explore contradictions or gaps in logic.</p>
<p>Jehovah&#8217;s Witnesses will bail out on anyone who really makes them work at  conducting a real intense Bible study. You found that out and so have a couple of others who have commented on the above article.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('729','Editor'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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		<title>By: Kurt</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-1#comment-727</link>
		<dc:creator>Kurt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 May 2011 18:10:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-727</guid>
		<description>I had a so called &quot;Bible&quot; study and it was the most tedious things I ever experienced. It was actually a study from the &quot;Bible Teach&quot; book. I noticed a certain pattern with the writing. It starts out with a paragraph making an assertion that checks out okay as being accurate compared to the cited scripture. Going through the chapter, the written material gets a bit farther from matching scripture, and more speculative. Eventually there are statements made that have very little connection to the cited scripture. This is all throughout the book! 
Another thing I noticed about the questions was that they were not real questions. They were really pseudo questions that would be answered by parroting what was written in the paragraph. When I would give real answers to the questions, as explained in scripture, the study conductor would get mad. Sometimes I would ask real questions that were not in the printed material and get elaborate explanations about something that had little to do with what I asked. Material that I could read and study in minutes by myself would take hours to go over, and they had the gall to criticize me for not making progress.
Many times I would ask where in scripture it says something they had told me and they could find none. They would instead ask me to go along with their human &quot;reasoning&quot; on the matter, which was unacceptable to me as I have no desire to follow after men. I would want scriptural support for their claims, and many times was met with either silence, or some scripture of no relevance to what I asked. One example was when I asked what scripture instructs me to have a religion. I could never get a scripture chapter and verse as an answer, but was instead showed a dictionary description of religion.
I found many changes and flip flops in their doctrine, as I got everything I could find going way back to Russell. I was pretty tolerant about old errors, but one thing I could not stand was current literature would have outright lies about the past. The Bible Teach book had a lie about the events of 1914 and I showed them what the literature actually said about the events of the time, and they got mad.
Many times it would come down to me disagreeing with some assertion that had no scriptural support. I would then be subject to attack about my motives and character. Often it would be in the form of one of them talking to the other about me in a negative way as if I were not there. I do not know if this was just his own corrupt practice or if he was actually trained to be that manipulative and offensive by the society.
One thing they considered to be fun was to constantly bash on Christians. They love to bash on how evil and corrupt Christians are, while boasting about how enlightened and truthful they are. It reached a sickening depth when they boasted about preaching to the entire world and I noticed the numbers from their yearbook said they had no preaching in China. I pointed out that there were some 65 million Christians in China, and if they were not preaching to them I wanted to know where they got the faith. He was dismissive of them, said they were with Satan&#039;s organization. He actually claimed that 65 million Christians that he never met personally were with Satan!
The greatest irony in this was how the study ended. They kept badgering me to go to meetings. I went to several devivals, district devivals and circuit devivals. (I call them devivals because they like being opposite of Christians and their revivals) I said I would start going as soon as they cleared up my unanswered questions. They wondered if they were wasting their time with me. I answered them, &quot;It is your time, so only you can say if you are wasting it or not. I never consider it a waste of my time to learn about God&#039;s word.&quot;
So one day when they were pitching the meetings, I asked why they assumed I did not go to meetings. They wondered what kingdom hall I had gone to. I said I had not been to a kingdom hall, but had studied the Bible with some Christians. They got really mad about that, and terminated the study that day.
I found their claim to run a Bible study is a false one as you would expect them to be delighted that I was going deeper into the Bible with the Christians. I found out the truth about their &quot;truth&quot; is that it is really just a recruiting tool&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;727&#039;,&#039;Kurt&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had a so called &#8220;Bible&#8221; study and it was the most tedious things I ever experienced. It was actually a study from the &#8220;Bible Teach&#8221; book. I noticed a certain pattern with the writing. It starts out with a paragraph making an assertion that checks out okay as being accurate compared to the cited scripture. Going through the chapter, the written material gets a bit farther from matching scripture, and more speculative. Eventually there are statements made that have very little connection to the cited scripture. This is all throughout the book!<br />
Another thing I noticed about the questions was that they were not real questions. They were really pseudo questions that would be answered by parroting what was written in the paragraph. When I would give real answers to the questions, as explained in scripture, the study conductor would get mad. Sometimes I would ask real questions that were not in the printed material and get elaborate explanations about something that had little to do with what I asked. Material that I could read and study in minutes by myself would take hours to go over, and they had the gall to criticize me for not making progress.<br />
Many times I would ask where in scripture it says something they had told me and they could find none. They would instead ask me to go along with their human &#8220;reasoning&#8221; on the matter, which was unacceptable to me as I have no desire to follow after men. I would want scriptural support for their claims, and many times was met with either silence, or some scripture of no relevance to what I asked. One example was when I asked what scripture instructs me to have a religion. I could never get a scripture chapter and verse as an answer, but was instead showed a dictionary description of religion.<br />
I found many changes and flip flops in their doctrine, as I got everything I could find going way back to Russell. I was pretty tolerant about old errors, but one thing I could not stand was current literature would have outright lies about the past. The Bible Teach book had a lie about the events of 1914 and I showed them what the literature actually said about the events of the time, and they got mad.<br />
Many times it would come down to me disagreeing with some assertion that had no scriptural support. I would then be subject to attack about my motives and character. Often it would be in the form of one of them talking to the other about me in a negative way as if I were not there. I do not know if this was just his own corrupt practice or if he was actually trained to be that manipulative and offensive by the society.<br />
One thing they considered to be fun was to constantly bash on Christians. They love to bash on how evil and corrupt Christians are, while boasting about how enlightened and truthful they are. It reached a sickening depth when they boasted about preaching to the entire world and I noticed the numbers from their yearbook said they had no preaching in China. I pointed out that there were some 65 million Christians in China, and if they were not preaching to them I wanted to know where they got the faith. He was dismissive of them, said they were with Satan&#8217;s organization. He actually claimed that 65 million Christians that he never met personally were with Satan!<br />
The greatest irony in this was how the study ended. They kept badgering me to go to meetings. I went to several devivals, district devivals and circuit devivals. (I call them devivals because they like being opposite of Christians and their revivals) I said I would start going as soon as they cleared up my unanswered questions. They wondered if they were wasting their time with me. I answered them, &#8220;It is your time, so only you can say if you are wasting it or not. I never consider it a waste of my time to learn about God&#8217;s word.&#8221;<br />
So one day when they were pitching the meetings, I asked why they assumed I did not go to meetings. They wondered what kingdom hall I had gone to. I said I had not been to a kingdom hall, but had studied the Bible with some Christians. They got really mad about that, and terminated the study that day.<br />
I found their claim to run a Bible study is a false one as you would expect them to be delighted that I was going deeper into the Bible with the Christians. I found out the truth about their &#8220;truth&#8221; is that it is really just a recruiting tool
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('727','Kurt'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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		<title>By: Morgan MacIntosh</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-1#comment-723</link>
		<dc:creator>Morgan MacIntosh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Apr 2011 16:51:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-723</guid>
		<description>A slight correction and a link to answer your question a little more fully.
The Watchtower magazine used to be called &quot;Zion&#039;s Watchtower and Herald of Christ&#039;s Presence&quot; , not Zion&#039;s Herald.
Oh and here is a link to why JW&#039;s discourage verifying their religion.
http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/religion_-_do_not_verify_.html

One of the things I want to point out for Thinking Christians.  Many active JW&#039;s come here and say mean and nasty things about this site and the people who run it, calling them apostates or being in league with Satan.  However not a one of them, when confronted with evidence from their own magazines and books can refute the information.  They use Bible verses (which can also be applied back to the Watchtower teachings) to &quot;prove&quot; we&#039;re mean nasty people who are only bent on &quot;taking&quot; them away from God.  No one can take you away from God except yourself.  Also it must be noted that historically the Jews in the Bible were God&#039;s people, yet Jesus and the Apostles were considered Apostates because of their teachings.  Oddly enough their teachings didn&#039;t refute Judaism or seek to overthrow them, but rather the teachings of Jesus showed that the leaders of the religion &quot;had made the Law of their God invalid because of their tradition&quot;.  The same thing has happened with the JW&#039;s.  They look to men rather than the Holy Spirit for guidance.  In the 10 years I have been out of the organization I have learned more about my Bible than at any time I was a JW.  It is one thing to be told what a Bible verse means and a very different thing to know for yourself through the Holy Spirit what a Bible verse means.  JW&#039;s have yet to learn this lesson.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;723&#039;,&#039;Morgan MacIntosh&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A slight correction and a link to answer your question a little more fully.<br />
The Watchtower magazine used to be called &#8220;Zion&#8217;s Watchtower and Herald of Christ&#8217;s Presence&#8221; , not Zion&#8217;s Herald.<br />
Oh and here is a link to why JW&#8217;s discourage verifying their religion.<br />
<a href="http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/religion_-_do_not_verify_.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/religion_-_do_not_verify_.html</a></p>
<p>One of the things I want to point out for Thinking Christians.  Many active JW&#8217;s come here and say mean and nasty things about this site and the people who run it, calling them apostates or being in league with Satan.  However not a one of them, when confronted with evidence from their own magazines and books can refute the information.  They use Bible verses (which can also be applied back to the Watchtower teachings) to &#8220;prove&#8221; we&#8217;re mean nasty people who are only bent on &#8220;taking&#8221; them away from God.  No one can take you away from God except yourself.  Also it must be noted that historically the Jews in the Bible were God&#8217;s people, yet Jesus and the Apostles were considered Apostates because of their teachings.  Oddly enough their teachings didn&#8217;t refute Judaism or seek to overthrow them, but rather the teachings of Jesus showed that the leaders of the religion &#8220;had made the Law of their God invalid because of their tradition&#8221;.  The same thing has happened with the JW&#8217;s.  They look to men rather than the Holy Spirit for guidance.  In the 10 years I have been out of the organization I have learned more about my Bible than at any time I was a JW.  It is one thing to be told what a Bible verse means and a very different thing to know for yourself through the Holy Spirit what a Bible verse means.  JW&#8217;s have yet to learn this lesson.
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		<title>By: Morgan MacIntosh</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-1#comment-722</link>
		<dc:creator>Morgan MacIntosh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Apr 2011 16:38:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-722</guid>
		<description>I was a JW for 8 years.  Sometimes it seems like a much longer time.  You are quite correct Sally about how Bible studies are conducted.  Part of the problem is the JW mindset.  They honestly believe that everything that is published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is the unadulterated inspired word of God, even though many teachings have changed over the years.  It&#039;s some sort of mass amnesia taking place with it comes to pointing out the changes that have occurred over the many years.  One would expect that if they were truly being led by God, then the teachings would remain the same from the first printing of Zion&#039;s Herald to the present day Watchtower magazine.  I challenge any JW to show me in the Bible where God laid down commandments and then later changed his mind, completely reversing himself on any teaching and then teaching the original material once again.  It never happened.  So how does a thinking Christian solve this problem.  They can only conclude that JW are not being led by men.  The Governing Body (the ones who actually run everything) says they are led by God&#039;s Holy Spirit to direct God&#039;s earthly organization here on Earth.  Where in the Bible does it say this?  It doesn&#039;t.  They manipulate scripture, take things out of context and gamble on the &quot;trust&quot; of their followers not to do independent research.  
Instead of going into a lot of detail, I&#039;ll simply post a link to an information website.  It&#039;s not a forum to post and leave comments, just an information page.  You can try to double check the information you find there in any Kingdom Hall from their own publications, but I doubt you will be allowed to do so.  Often the older publications are simply there for display, you won&#039;t actually be allowed to read them.  If you do an Elder will quickly try to ascertain why.  You might wonder what all the fuss is about.  Do they have something to hide or be ashamed of?
Here&#039;s the link: http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/new_light_doctrine.html&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;722&#039;,&#039;Morgan MacIntosh&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was a JW for 8 years.  Sometimes it seems like a much longer time.  You are quite correct Sally about how Bible studies are conducted.  Part of the problem is the JW mindset.  They honestly believe that everything that is published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is the unadulterated inspired word of God, even though many teachings have changed over the years.  It&#8217;s some sort of mass amnesia taking place with it comes to pointing out the changes that have occurred over the many years.  One would expect that if they were truly being led by God, then the teachings would remain the same from the first printing of Zion&#8217;s Herald to the present day Watchtower magazine.  I challenge any JW to show me in the Bible where God laid down commandments and then later changed his mind, completely reversing himself on any teaching and then teaching the original material once again.  It never happened.  So how does a thinking Christian solve this problem.  They can only conclude that JW are not being led by men.  The Governing Body (the ones who actually run everything) says they are led by God&#8217;s Holy Spirit to direct God&#8217;s earthly organization here on Earth.  Where in the Bible does it say this?  It doesn&#8217;t.  They manipulate scripture, take things out of context and gamble on the &#8220;trust&#8221; of their followers not to do independent research.<br />
Instead of going into a lot of detail, I&#8217;ll simply post a link to an information website.  It&#8217;s not a forum to post and leave comments, just an information page.  You can try to double check the information you find there in any Kingdom Hall from their own publications, but I doubt you will be allowed to do so.  Often the older publications are simply there for display, you won&#8217;t actually be allowed to read them.  If you do an Elder will quickly try to ascertain why.  You might wonder what all the fuss is about.  Do they have something to hide or be ashamed of?<br />
Here&#8217;s the link: <a href="http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/new_light_doctrine.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/new_light_doctrine.html</a>
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('722','Morgan MacIntosh'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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		<title>By: Sally</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-1#comment-721</link>
		<dc:creator>Sally</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Apr 2011 05:23:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-721</guid>
		<description>Wow! You know that really makes sense what you wrote about, &quot;A simple request to &#039;show me in the Bible where it says…&#039; will often bring a book study or a discussion with a Jehovah’s Witness to a dead stop.&quot; Because that is exactly the way it happened. I thought I did something wrong.

I have been begging her for days for her to change her mind, or to set me up with someone else if she no longer wished to study with me. She will not reply back to me at all. Worse than that, she never answered my questions or tried to show me why my viewpoint was wrong through the use of the Bible. Although she would often just give me sections of the Watchtower or Awake to read to show me why I was wrong. But those seemed to be a person&#039;s point of view, their opinions, and not Bible backed 100%. 

But how can someone ask me to accept something at face value, when they are saying it comes from the Bible, and then cannot provide the Bible verses that back up that logic they are preaching? I am not trying to be defiant, or anything like that. I just wanted to know where they got that information from within the Bible. And why did those teachings seem to contradict many other Bible verses (since the Bible is the sole source for their information on who God is)?

I even tried to get references to what was being quoted, and where they were getting information from in the Watchtower and Awake. I finally had to call the headquarters. They told me that I could write a letter, and they could mail me the entire references. But it would be too much work to tell me over the phone one by one who said what. I understand that it is backed up in a computer system at Watchtower headquarters, but I wonder how many people seek out where the Watchtower/Awake are getting their information from. To me it feels like a form of plagiarism. 

I felt that it is the &quot;blind leading the blind&quot; in a sense, but I did want to keep an open-mind because it is easy for people to have hatred toward what they don&#039;t understand. Yet, after my encounter I feel it is very easy to memorize Bible verses, but another thing to actually be guided by the holy spirit to know what those versus mean. 

I would like to make a suggestion though for this site. It would be great to take each Q&amp;A within a section they are teaching through their books, ant then debating these issues they bring up. I know that it has taken me hours to research a paragraph at times (I was using the NWT, NLT, and the KJV); it would be nice to have easier access to that information. I would love to send you what I have on the questions I presented to my study group for Chapter 1, the Trinity, and the Memorial (I guess that was the one that got me kicked out of my study sessions and branded me a trouble maker).

As for me, I plan to keep studying on my own. I don&#039;t hate the lady I was studying with. I&#039;m just sad that she wanted me to keep an open-mind, but then turned her back on me when I was able to provide a lot of documentation from her own Bible that was contradictory to what she was teaching me from the Watchtower publications - and not solely the Bible - about what the Bible says who God is.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;721&#039;,&#039;Sally&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow! You know that really makes sense what you wrote about, &#8220;A simple request to &#8216;show me in the Bible where it says…&#8217; will often bring a book study or a discussion with a Jehovah’s Witness to a dead stop.&#8221; Because that is exactly the way it happened. I thought I did something wrong.</p>
<p>I have been begging her for days for her to change her mind, or to set me up with someone else if she no longer wished to study with me. She will not reply back to me at all. Worse than that, she never answered my questions or tried to show me why my viewpoint was wrong through the use of the Bible. Although she would often just give me sections of the Watchtower or Awake to read to show me why I was wrong. But those seemed to be a person&#8217;s point of view, their opinions, and not Bible backed 100%. </p>
<p>But how can someone ask me to accept something at face value, when they are saying it comes from the Bible, and then cannot provide the Bible verses that back up that logic they are preaching? I am not trying to be defiant, or anything like that. I just wanted to know where they got that information from within the Bible. And why did those teachings seem to contradict many other Bible verses (since the Bible is the sole source for their information on who God is)?</p>
<p>I even tried to get references to what was being quoted, and where they were getting information from in the Watchtower and Awake. I finally had to call the headquarters. They told me that I could write a letter, and they could mail me the entire references. But it would be too much work to tell me over the phone one by one who said what. I understand that it is backed up in a computer system at Watchtower headquarters, but I wonder how many people seek out where the Watchtower/Awake are getting their information from. To me it feels like a form of plagiarism. </p>
<p>I felt that it is the &#8220;blind leading the blind&#8221; in a sense, but I did want to keep an open-mind because it is easy for people to have hatred toward what they don&#8217;t understand. Yet, after my encounter I feel it is very easy to memorize Bible verses, but another thing to actually be guided by the holy spirit to know what those versus mean. </p>
<p>I would like to make a suggestion though for this site. It would be great to take each Q&#038;A within a section they are teaching through their books, ant then debating these issues they bring up. I know that it has taken me hours to research a paragraph at times (I was using the NWT, NLT, and the KJV); it would be nice to have easier access to that information. I would love to send you what I have on the questions I presented to my study group for Chapter 1, the Trinity, and the Memorial (I guess that was the one that got me kicked out of my study sessions and branded me a trouble maker).</p>
<p>As for me, I plan to keep studying on my own. I don&#8217;t hate the lady I was studying with. I&#8217;m just sad that she wanted me to keep an open-mind, but then turned her back on me when I was able to provide a lot of documentation from her own Bible that was contradictory to what she was teaching me from the Watchtower publications &#8211; and not solely the Bible &#8211; about what the Bible says who God is.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('721','Sally'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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		<title>By: Editor</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-1#comment-720</link>
		<dc:creator>Editor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Apr 2011 21:57:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-720</guid>
		<description>Sally,

You are not alone in your experiences having a Jehovah&#039;s Witness &quot;Bible&quot; study. Like their meetings, JWs are trained that you, as the student, must accept each paragraph and scripture quotation as it is written in your study book. Your questions must be limited to just that paragraph.

In past years some lively debate and commentary was allowed and even encouraged during studies and meetings. Public talks were actually prepared by the speaker using a basic outline provided by the Society, but with room for enhanced explanation and the addition of other supporting Bible verses. 

But this isn&#039;t the case now. It&#039;s all &quot;read the paragraph, ask the question, answer from the paragraph only, and then immediately move on to the next paragraph.&quot; If you come across a sentence that you think doesn&#039;t make sense, or a scripture quote that seems not to fit the subject, you&#039;ll find it difficult to halt the study to discuss your questions further. Do that during a Kingdom Hall study meeting and you&#039;ll get escorted to the door. That&#039;s because JWs are trained to stay on the path to the next paragraph, accept what is written, and keep moving.

This is why Jehovah&#039;s Witnesses are good book study conductors, but really lousy Bible students. They claim expertise in knowledge of the Bible, but it does not take much to get a JW to acknowledge that he has to do &quot;further research&quot; or &quot;go look up that answer&quot; with even the most basic of Bible subjects.

Ask them to show you where it says in the Bible that the year 1914 marked the return of Jesus to his throne. Then ask them what visible proof is there to prove that actually happened.

Ask them to show you where in the Bible that modern people are not allowed to have blood transfusions, and yet can have most of the components of blood injected into their veins. Ask them why JWs that do accept blood transfusions are then considered to be &quot;disassociated.&quot;

Ask them to show you in the Bible that it is unchristian for JW men to wear beards or sideburns.

Ask them to show you in the Bible that women shouldn&#039;t wear slacks in service or at meetings.

A simple request to &quot;show me in the Bible where it says...&quot; will often bring a book study or a discussion with a Jehovah&#039;s Witness to a dead stop. Some get quite angry when asked to do that. By far the majority will ask for time to go home and look up the answer to your question. Then they will come back, not with Bible scriptures, but mostly quotations from Watchtower publications, especially older Watchtower magazines.

My experience with JWs would indicate that maybe 10-15% of them could stand up to a rigorous discussion of their teachings, while most, like your lady, will just write you off as being obstinate or a waste of their time.  You quickly move from being a potential convert to an &quot;evil person.&quot;

Please take your time in deciding how deep you want to study the Watchtower&#039;s teachings. More importantly, don&#039;t be afraid to challenge your own need to follow their many unsupported and often contradictory doctrines.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;720&#039;,&#039;Editor&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sally,</p>
<p>You are not alone in your experiences having a Jehovah&#8217;s Witness &#8220;Bible&#8221; study. Like their meetings, JWs are trained that you, as the student, must accept each paragraph and scripture quotation as it is written in your study book. Your questions must be limited to just that paragraph.</p>
<p>In past years some lively debate and commentary was allowed and even encouraged during studies and meetings. Public talks were actually prepared by the speaker using a basic outline provided by the Society, but with room for enhanced explanation and the addition of other supporting Bible verses. </p>
<p>But this isn&#8217;t the case now. It&#8217;s all &#8220;read the paragraph, ask the question, answer from the paragraph only, and then immediately move on to the next paragraph.&#8221; If you come across a sentence that you think doesn&#8217;t make sense, or a scripture quote that seems not to fit the subject, you&#8217;ll find it difficult to halt the study to discuss your questions further. Do that during a Kingdom Hall study meeting and you&#8217;ll get escorted to the door. That&#8217;s because JWs are trained to stay on the path to the next paragraph, accept what is written, and keep moving.</p>
<p>This is why Jehovah&#8217;s Witnesses are good book study conductors, but really lousy Bible students. They claim expertise in knowledge of the Bible, but it does not take much to get a JW to acknowledge that he has to do &#8220;further research&#8221; or &#8220;go look up that answer&#8221; with even the most basic of Bible subjects.</p>
<p>Ask them to show you where it says in the Bible that the year 1914 marked the return of Jesus to his throne. Then ask them what visible proof is there to prove that actually happened.</p>
<p>Ask them to show you where in the Bible that modern people are not allowed to have blood transfusions, and yet can have most of the components of blood injected into their veins. Ask them why JWs that do accept blood transfusions are then considered to be &#8220;disassociated.&#8221;</p>
<p>Ask them to show you in the Bible that it is unchristian for JW men to wear beards or sideburns.</p>
<p>Ask them to show you in the Bible that women shouldn&#8217;t wear slacks in service or at meetings.</p>
<p>A simple request to &#8220;show me in the Bible where it says&#8230;&#8221; will often bring a book study or a discussion with a Jehovah&#8217;s Witness to a dead stop. Some get quite angry when asked to do that. By far the majority will ask for time to go home and look up the answer to your question. Then they will come back, not with Bible scriptures, but mostly quotations from Watchtower publications, especially older Watchtower magazines.</p>
<p>My experience with JWs would indicate that maybe 10-15% of them could stand up to a rigorous discussion of their teachings, while most, like your lady, will just write you off as being obstinate or a waste of their time.  You quickly move from being a potential convert to an &#8220;evil person.&#8221;</p>
<p>Please take your time in deciding how deep you want to study the Watchtower&#8217;s teachings. More importantly, don&#8217;t be afraid to challenge your own need to follow their many unsupported and often contradictory doctrines.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('720','Editor'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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		<title>By: Sally</title>
		<link>http://ex-jw.com/truth-about-jw-bible-studies/comment-page-1#comment-719</link>
		<dc:creator>Sally</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Apr 2011 07:53:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ex-jw.com/?p=288#comment-719</guid>
		<description>All I know is I couldn&#039;t do their &quot;read this, and give the answer just as it is already written for you.&quot; I don&#039;t want people to tell me the answers. I want to research the answers, and find other Bible verses to back up the material I was given to read. We didn&#039;t even get past chapter 1 in my study book. I wasn&#039;t being mean, or negative, or anything. I was just pointing out scriptures from my Bible and trying to understand. But when I asked questions, they went unanswered most of the time, or I was told that they could be answered in later chapters. Yet when I went to the chapters she referred me to, my questions weren&#039;t answered. 

My study partner was a full-time study lady whose husband was an elder. She gave up on me, even though I begged her for days not to. I even asked her to pair me with someone else who maybe could keep up with me - if she felt she was unable to. Her only answer was that I should email any further questions to the Watchtower&#039;s NY headquarters and attend meetings at the Kingdom Hall. 

From this experience I feel like the only way I would be accepted into the JW community is if I sat there like a droid, simply giving the answers the Watchtower Society pre-wrote. I feel shunned for having individual thoughts - and asking questions. I don&#039;t feel that God or Jesus would turn people away just for asking questions, or for more explanation. 

I don&#039;t know. I am just really frustrated - and hurt. 

The JW people I spoke with during my few weeks of study were constantly telling me how non-JW churches are not following God&#039;s word, and teaching hate. But in all honesty, I attend a non-JW church, and have never - not once - heard any of the accusations they were stating about what pastors preach from my pastor. We never have bad-mouthed JWs. We never have condoned anything un-biblical, although we do have contradictory interpretations. I will admit that. Those are the scriptures I was bringing up with my study partner. I would say, &quot;But my Bible says this, it seems these two points are not equal. Can you explain to me why?&quot;

So yeah. I am not sure where to go from here. I want to keep studying, to make sure I what the real truth is. But I certainly can&#039;t imagine writing a person with a desk number for a name to help me study. That&#039;s just my viewpoint.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;719&#039;,&#039;Sally&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All I know is I couldn&#8217;t do their &#8220;read this, and give the answer just as it is already written for you.&#8221; I don&#8217;t want people to tell me the answers. I want to research the answers, and find other Bible verses to back up the material I was given to read. We didn&#8217;t even get past chapter 1 in my study book. I wasn&#8217;t being mean, or negative, or anything. I was just pointing out scriptures from my Bible and trying to understand. But when I asked questions, they went unanswered most of the time, or I was told that they could be answered in later chapters. Yet when I went to the chapters she referred me to, my questions weren&#8217;t answered. </p>
<p>My study partner was a full-time study lady whose husband was an elder. She gave up on me, even though I begged her for days not to. I even asked her to pair me with someone else who maybe could keep up with me &#8211; if she felt she was unable to. Her only answer was that I should email any further questions to the Watchtower&#8217;s NY headquarters and attend meetings at the Kingdom Hall. </p>
<p>From this experience I feel like the only way I would be accepted into the JW community is if I sat there like a droid, simply giving the answers the Watchtower Society pre-wrote. I feel shunned for having individual thoughts &#8211; and asking questions. I don&#8217;t feel that God or Jesus would turn people away just for asking questions, or for more explanation. </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know. I am just really frustrated &#8211; and hurt. </p>
<p>The JW people I spoke with during my few weeks of study were constantly telling me how non-JW churches are not following God&#8217;s word, and teaching hate. But in all honesty, I attend a non-JW church, and have never &#8211; not once &#8211; heard any of the accusations they were stating about what pastors preach from my pastor. We never have bad-mouthed JWs. We never have condoned anything un-biblical, although we do have contradictory interpretations. I will admit that. Those are the scriptures I was bringing up with my study partner. I would say, &#8220;But my Bible says this, it seems these two points are not equal. Can you explain to me why?&#8221;</p>
<p>So yeah. I am not sure where to go from here. I want to keep studying, to make sure I what the real truth is. But I certainly can&#8217;t imagine writing a person with a desk number for a name to help me study. That&#8217;s just my viewpoint.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('719','Sally'); return false;">Reply</a> </div>
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